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Talk:Shadow Clone Technique
Hand Seals? where did you get those hand seals. From what ive seen, it appears that the shadow clone uses a single handseal unlike those on the page. Shuriken Kage Bunshin no Jutsu It seems that Ninjas can make shadow clones of objects, not just themselves. When fighting Orochimaru the 3rd Hokage threw a single shuriken and then made multiple copies of it to turn it into a swarm (Chapter 117). In episode 190 of Naruto Shippuden, Naruto and the Old Soldier, this jutsu makes another appearance. Should we mention this? Jutsu Level I thought the Shadow Clone Jutsu was a Jonin Level Technique. Izumo Kamizuki said that in Naruto Episode 60 when Naruto went up against Neji in the Chunin Finals. - Zero - Talk 11:49, 14 December 2008 (UTC) Gaara fight It says that he made 1999 clones using the fox's chakra, but Naruto doesn't use the fox's chakra until he needs to summon gamabunta, meaning that he can create 1999 clones with his own chakra reserves Chakra Based of what is stated in chapter 433, pg 9. It is safe to say that at the dispelling of shadow Clones that any chakra remaining since their creation goes back the user when dispelled. SuperN 15:02, 30 January 2009 (UTC) Guy When Guy disappears after talking to Lee and Team 7 in episode 22, he disappears like shadow clones do. Is there anything to that, or am I just imagining things? Hakinu talk | 11:27, 22 May 2009 (UTC) :Well, they dont show much about guys abilities, other that taijutsu...Apparently he can summon, but he did it only once....he can probably use ninjutsu, as lee was the first person to graduate frm the academy, with taijutsu alon, but i think he's stickin to taijutsu, to make lee feel better, and to prove u dont need ninjutsu....so, ya he prob can use it...ost jounin's can....but i dont think we'll evr find out, unless he fights an opponent that fources him to use ninjutsu..AlienGamer | Talk 11:31, 22 May 2009 (UTC) ::I would guess that it was the Body Flicker Technique. Jacce | Talk 12:06, 22 May 2009 (UTC) ::: That would make sense. /Agree Hakinu talk | 12:45, 22 May 2009 (UTC) Chapter 412, page 9. Fukusaku says that it would be the end of naruto if any of his clones turn into frogs. Also, shouldn't this be listed as a training method as well? (talk) 22:26, 23 May 2009 (UTC) about kakashis dissapearing in part 1and 2 in part2 when he reveals him self to the new sakura and naruto he says my bad my bad auctually an old lady wanted some help and i and they said its a lie he may have used a shadow clone jutsu Sartorias (talk) 18:25, 10 August 2009 (UTC) Distributing Chakra Just to clarify something mentioned in the article, where it says that chakra is evenly distributed amongst the clones, is it referring to each clone having the same amount? Or does it work on the basis that if, say, Naruto makes one clone, his chakra is instantly halved? Or if he makes 1999, he's only left with 1/2000 of what he had? Dartblaze (talk) 09:10, October 16, 2009 (UTC) Just saying Naruto can put how much chakra he wants into each clone the chakra is not evenly distributed among the clones. The strength is the same without any cost but the chakra is decided by naruto. Neji made it clear that the chakra was equally distributed between the clones in chapter 100 page 6.Jacce | Talk 09:35, October 16, 2009 (UTC) Shuriken Kage Bunshin No Jutsu The shuriken clone techniquie is not as simple ans others ans you have to focus your chakra into an inanimate object to make exact solid copys of it. It also uses up more chakra than you would think :Do you have any source? And sign your posts with ~~~~. Jacce | Talk 09:35, October 16, 2009 (UTC) Nagato Yah, nagato Animal Path (or his summon uses it?) uses this in his fight with jiriyia, anime only. Also, remove Bunshinjutsu and see also and set Jutsu classification=Ninjutsu, Bunshinjutsu Simant (talk) 23:36, October 17, 2009 (UTC) Mistake in Multiple Shadow Clone Technique description It is said in the article that Naruto needs the Kyuubi's chakra to make multiple shadow clones. That is clearly wrong. He makes multiple shadow clones using his own chakra, as seen in the very first chapter/episode, when he apparently did not know to use the Kyuubi's chakra. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 16:52, November 15, 2009 (UTC) :Ebisu said that since the fox chakra is always mixing with Naruto's own, he has trouble molding chakra. So he is always using some fox chakra. Jacce | Talk 17:10, November 15, 2009 (UTC) Enma I think Enma used this technique - it's a parent jutsu of Adamantine Prison Wall.-- (talk) 21:31, March 12, 2010 (UTC) :The one databook translation I found doesn't make any indication that they're shadow clones. ''~SnapperT '' 23:14, March 12, 2010 (UTC) Deidara When did Deidara used this? Jacce | Talk | 06:40, May 15, 2010 (UTC) :During his fight against Team Kakashi and Team Guy. He did it offscreen. 07:52, May 15, 2010 (UTC) :Shadow clones are a component of Suicide Bombing Clone. ''~SnapperT '' 16:54, May 15, 2010 (UTC) Title in question? I thought this move was called Kage Bushin no Jutsu. Why is it Shadow Clone Technique? I think the articles on this wikia should be refered after what they are called in Japan and not by what a dubbing/subbing company calls it because it can lead to confusion. We can say "in the english versions, it is called the Shadow Clone Technique" but the article itself is different. ( (talk) 21:13, November 3, 2010 (UTC)) :We use the literal translation of the Japanese names, save for some exceptions, such as techniques which are names of deities, Chidori and Rasegan, as well as their variants. Omnibender - Talk - 22:08, November 3, 2010 (UTC) ::Uhhh...I am aware of kage meaning shadow and bushin meaning means clone, but if that's the wikia's rules, I will respect that. I only think we should use the original name, but like I said, I respect the rules ( (talk) 22:16, November 4, 2010 (UTC)) :::It's simpler on readers. Using romaji would at times mean a bunch of macrons, making things a pain to search for, and on average people prefer an English name. ''~SnapperT '' 22:40, November 4, 2010 (UTC) Shadow clones X2 Can a shadow clone use shadow clone jutsu?Elvesyou--JS 19:27, November 25, 2010 (UTC) :Technically speaking, yes. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 22:06, November 25, 2010 (UTC) ::So by that logic say naruto summons 10 shadow clones (splits his chakra into 10 equals) then that shadow clone makes 10 more and so on doesn't that mean that the clones will have less and less chakra?Elvesyou--JS 20:11, November 26, 2010 (UTC) :::Technically speaking, yes. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 20:15, November 26, 2010 (UTC) ::::so by that sense an unlimited amount of shadow clones can be made and the user doesn't have to waste chakra, so in other words, the user really only has to make one batch while the "pre" existing shadow clones make the rest, correct?.Elvesyou--JS 15:53, December 11, 2010 (UTC) :::::Technically speaking, yes. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 20:45, December 11, 2010 (UTC) ::::::So by that logic anybody can make an unlimited amount with no risks?Elvesyou--JS 23:13, December 11, 2010 (UTC) :::::::With no benefits as well, since the clones would have less and less chakra, making them pretty much useless. Omnibender - Talk - 23:22, December 11, 2010 (UTC) ::::::::Yes but any normal shadow clone dissipates after one hit, so really it would make no difference, and really there is no down-side as, they would eventually get to the stage of being to hard to fight because of the sheer numbers (excluding to Sharingan, Rennigan, Byakugan and that unnamed dojutsu users), plus it's costing the user no chakra whatsoever, meaning it's pretty much an unlimited amount of shadow clones, so really I don't see a downside, well apart from the fact that their considerably weaker because of the lack of chakra, though they all have access to nine-tails power, so that could compensate. Elvesyou--JS 23:31, December 11, 2010 (UTC) :No, Omnibender is right. Making shadow clones like this will eventually become useless. Several of the advantages of the technique disappear when you take on this tactic: :Shadow clones are usually indistinguishable from the user, but with this tactic that is no longer the case. :Shadow clones can usually do techniques, but with this tactic they no longer have the required chakra. :Shadow clones are usually rather durable and good enough to at least hit the enemy once, but with this tactic they would be barely more durable or useful than normal clones. :The shadow clones might actually be in danger of disappearing because of having too little chakra. :—ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 23:50, December 11, 2010 (UTC) :Okay I see your point in that however using other jutsu's to take the user underground or hide them would compensate for distinguishing the user but they would have to get through the clones, which in fact can be used as a sort of trap I guess as you could exploit disadvantages to your advantage, and maybe not to use the tactic to much, cos after the clones are gone the chakra returns to the user. :the way I mean isn't to use it all the time, I just mean rather than constantly having to use it, but instead in a chakra saving way, I will give an example. The user is fighting in rocky terrain and has a fair amount of chakra (enough to make 20 clones and perform 2 rasengans) they need 1 clone for rasengan leaving 19, 8 shadow clones use shadow clone jutsu and each make 20 and have them transform into rocks, now the other 9 or so distract the opponent while rasengan's charging then when ready the clones spring up and fight and are taken out, the clones make more while naruto is running at the opponent, gaining his focus the clones keep him still while naruto delivers the final blow I don't see a real problem there?Elvesyou--JS 00:08, December 12, 2010 (UTC) ::The chakra doesn't return to the user. At least not all of it. if it did, the Multiple Shadow Clone Technique would never have been considered so dangerous. ::Any way, your tactic is unnecessary for Naruto. He doesn't need to be careful with chakra in that way, nor would he be able to think up tactics as complicated as this one. Nor does it fit his style, as he would simply use the Multiple Shadow Clone Technique and do the same things without problem. In fact, he did so during his fight with the Deva Path Pain. ::Yes, what you're suggesting is technically possible. However, for anyone who might want to use it, it is infeasible and for anyone who could use it, it is unnecessary. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 01:28, December 12, 2010 (UTC) :::Yeah I guess Naruto isn't exactly the best person to use, then again this tactic could also be applied for searching. Because it is definitely more effective than its pre-decesser, all in all it all depends on the user to need strategies like this, people like Shikamaru for instance.Elvesyou--JS 01:35, December 12, 2010 (UTC) I take it the recent manga chapters confirm the statement that Shadow Clones makes Shadow Shadow Clones (talk) 18:37, November 1, 2011 (UTC) Freewill? Im not entirely sure about the manga, I didn't really read it until part 2, but I remember in one of the first episodes of the anime Naruto drinks bad milk and he and his clones fight amoungst each other over a toilet. I think there have been other instances of this too. I know it has only been for comedic purposes, but isn't it worth noting maybe just in the trivia section that shadow clones (at least Naruto's) have displayed some degree of freewill/can disagree with the user's will? Not entirely sure on the phrasing so i'll leave that to someone else. :No one has ever said they were mindless clones --Cerez365 (talk) 13:12, January 11, 2011 (UTC) So the downside to a clone is less chakra then the jutsu user, then does that mean the shadow clone gets all or a portion of intelligence? Just wondering SusanooUnleashed (talk) 06:37, April 27, 2011 (UTC) Shadow Clone vs. Sharingan Yes, sasuke says that he can tell but the article says through events in the series that he is actually just tacking the original that he actually tell. But through what events i need a reference of sorts to validate the statement :Early in their fight in the Valley of the End, don't remember which chapter or episode. Omnibender - Talk - 20:52, April 26, 2011 (UTC) ::Episode 130, couldn't find the same in the manga. Jacce | Talk | 05:09, April 27, 2011 (UTC) :::I'm about 95% certain that this was one of those anime mistakes, meaning it never was in the manga. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 10:20, April 27, 2011 (UTC) Usage by Konohamaru / Different hand seal? During episode 161 ("Surname is Sarutobi, Given Name Konohamaru"), Konohamaru performs the Dragon hand seal, even though it had no immediate effect - while still producing that distinct sound that "plays" when the seals for a jutsu are completed -, and later it turned out he was a Shadow Clone. While it is possible that he set everything up beforehand, isn't it also a possibility that at that point, the Dragon seal was used to create the clone? I mean, it is known that for different individuals, the hand seals needed for the same jutsu can differ, and the same person, if practiced the jutsu, might need different hand seals than he did earlier, so this could make sense, couldn't it? SpecB (talk) 12:19, July 23, 2011 (UTC) :I wouldn't say so. People have always been very clear with Shadow Clone hand seal, and the only thing we know that can change about handseals is making the sequence shorter if you're a master of the technique. I don't see that happening with the shadow clone, since it's only one seal. Omnibender - Talk - 21:44, July 23, 2011 (UTC) ::I was thinking the same first, but I couldn't make sense of a few things. First of all, like I mentioned, the typical... how should I call it, "jutsu activation sound effect" can be heard, and we know that unless it's a more complex technique - one we wouldn't expect from Konohamaru -, jutsus can take effect from that point. Also it should be noted that Konohamaru was never shown to know more jutsu. Then again he could have set the clone up earlier, since he knew what was going on with Ebisu, and maybe the sound effect was put there as a mistake - I'm not sure if the "ba-" onomatopoeia is the sound of his hands clapping, or is it the jutsu's -, but it'd be pretty pointless to have that much emphasis on a hand seal that serves no purpose. SpecB (talk) 12:49, July 25, 2011 (UTC) :::You're right, that emphasis on the hand seal did serve a purpose: it showed us Konohamaru was capable of doing more than just basic techniques and the techniques taught to him by Naruto, without Kishimoto-sensei actually having to show us the techniques. :::Making Konohamaru use an alternative hand seal for a technique as iconic as Kage Bunshin without clearly showing us that would be pathetic writing on Kishimoto-sensei's part. I'd be more willing to assume he isn't such a poor author. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 17:26, July 26, 2011 (UTC) Usage with Body Replacement Technique Another thing I have been thinking of, is that a lot of times Naruto performs the Shadow Clone Technique, with a few clones showing up, surrounded by smoke(-ish something), so we get to know which one is the real, but then it turns out that one was a fake. I'm assuming that when performing this jutsu, a kind of Body Replacement Technique is also carried out so the original body remains hidden among the clones. This would also make sense considering the nature of this technique: creating real bodies and evenly distributing the chakra among them serves the purpose that they can't be distinguished, but if the original stayed at the same place as they did before the jutsu, then it probably wouldn't be a big deal to follow the movement of the original with, say, the Sharingan, or even if the opponent has keen reflexes and can stay focused while battling the clones. This would also go along with the "fact" that apparently higher-level shinobi don't need to perform hand seals for the Body Replacement Technique - although it would raise a question as well, namely that we never saw Naruto use it, so in the end the most logical option is that the Shadow Clone Technique includes the Body Replacement Technique as a sort of "bonus". Any thoughts? SpecB (talk) 12:35, July 23, 2011 (UTC) :Logical reasoning, but since something like this was never even hinted in the manga, I don't think it should be mentioned. Sometimes the smoke doesn't dissipate fast, so there might be a time for the real one to move around without actually using BFT. Omnibender - Talk - 21:44, July 23, 2011 (UTC) Experience Question Has it been stated whether or not the knowledge that the clone gains only goes to the original or would it go to the original and their other active clones? Skitts (talk) 19:14, October 23, 2011 (UTC) :It's only been said that it does back to the original, nothing of the clones.--Cerez365™ 19:16, October 23, 2011 (UTC) ::It goes to all clones, we've seen it. When Naruto got tips about wind nature transformation from Asuma, he dispersed one clone, and all others, original and clones, learned the trick. Omnibender - Talk - 19:58, October 23, 2011 (UTC) Ah, thanks for the answer. Was that anime-only? I was wondering because I remembered that after Itachi took down Nagato, Naruto made a clone that screwed with his Rikudo Mode and it dispersed, so I was wondering whether that meant all of the clones knew of what went on with Itachi and Nagato. Skitts (talk) 22:43, October 23, 2011 (UTC) :I think that happened in the manga as well, though I'd have to check to be sure. Either Naruto clones know it and we were simply not shown this, or maybe since the clone was too feeble, it didn't get to become aware of things so when it dispersed, there was nothing to send back? Or maybe they're so far apart that it takes a while for the information to reach the clone? Naruto and Fukasaku summoned his clones from Myobokuzan, so my guess is that either it would take too long for the information to reach them, or that the chakra which returns to the original, with the experience and all, would simply disperse along the way before it reached the others or the original. Omnibender - Talk - 23:03, October 23, 2011 (UTC) ::It happened in the manga.--''Deva '' 23:10, October 23, 2011 (UTC) :::Ah yes it did happen. I think I was concentrating on where the chakra went instead of experience.--Cerez365™ 23:34, October 23, 2011 (UTC) bunshin produce bunshin so, after manga goes this far.I have question i was think. Can a clone makes another clone? (and why ?) because in part 1 and shippuden , naruto never do that until the chapter when naruto's clone fight real madara. --Jumpjet (talk) 12:06, October 28, 2011 (UTC) :Shadow clones can use any technique that the original can once they have sufficient chakra. In chapter 561 you saw his clone make more clones.--Cerez365™ 12:25, October 28, 2011 (UTC) :The clones have never needed to before, because they have never been split up like this--''Deva '' 12:37, October 28, 2011 (UTC) Can the original user multiple objects with Shadow Clones? For example: Naruto holds an apple. He does the Shadow Clone Jutsu. Does the clone has an apple now too? -- (talk) 19:38, February 1, 2012 (UTC)Saki :I think so. Whenever Naruto has cloned himself, the clones has the same equipment, like kunai and shurikens, as the original. Jacce | Talk | 20:04, February 1, 2012 (UTC) About the trivia Did not Madara state he can tell the difference between the real one and a wood clone ? --Elveonora (talk) 22:59, March 9, 2012 (UTC) He could see through Hashiramas Wood Clone Technique. SusanooUnleashed (talk) 23:44, March 9, 2012 (UTC) I know, my point being that sharingan can distinguish a clone after all. --Elveonora (talk) 23:46, March 9, 2012 (UTC) :Because the wood clone is made of wood. Shadow clone creates a perfect copy. Omnibender - Talk - 03:20, March 10, 2012 (UTC) And Water Clones are made of water, Lighting Clones of lighting etc. But is not Water Clone just a Shadow Clone with water element added to it ? I mean, they are solid, can use techniques and when dispelled, the remaining chakra and knowledge gained are added to the user. The clone disperse into wood on the same conditions as Shadow Clones dispel ... when hit so they lose focus to maintain their state, right ? Thus Any solid clone is a copy of the user. That's my point, Madara was able to see it's a Wood Clone with his Sharingan thus tell the fake from original. Then I don't see why it would be false for any other type of solid clone. --Elveonora (talk) 15:47, March 10, 2012 (UTC) No. The only clones that were ever said to be Shadow Clone plus something are Lightning Release Shadow Clone (per name), the anime Earth Release Shadow Clone (anime-only technique, also per name), and Deidara's Suicide Bombing Clone (per databook description). No clone other than the Shadow Clone was ever said to send remaining chakra and acquired knowledge back to the original. The clone is made of wood made to look like the original, it's made of something else, and that difference is apparent to the Sharingan. Shadow clones are perfect copies. Omnibender - Talk - 15:52, March 10, 2012 (UTC) Oh, right. Thought all elemental clones are enhanced shadow clones. But reading thw Wood Clone technique article it works differently ... sorry then. --Elveonora (talk) 16:07, March 10, 2012 (UTC) Immunity to genjutsu In chapter 260, the clone containing 30% of Itachi's chakra put Kakashi's shadow clone under an illusion: Demonic Illusion Burning Paper Body but it didn't work and Itachi says 'No wonder you aren't affected by the illusion, this is a shadow clone' doesn't this mean shadow clones are immune to genjutsu? Shouldn't it be mentioned?FlyingRaijin (talk) 19:12, March 12, 2012 (UTC) :The shadow clone is trapped in a genjutsu, not the one who created the shadow clone. Omnibender - Talk - 22:01, March 12, 2012 (UTC) But Kakashi's clone could still move even as it was in the genjutsu, it grabbed Itachi to keep him in place and Itachi said he wasn't affected by the genjutsu.FlyingRaijin (talk) 10:10, March 13, 2012 (UTC) ::The clone was shown being affected by the genjutsu, we saw it seeing itself as a burning paper. Omnibender - Talk - 00:14, March 14, 2012 (UTC) "No wonder there was no reaction to the genjutsu… This is a Shadow Clone…" (「幻術に手応えが無いハズだ…これは影分身…」, "Genjutsu ni tegotae ga nai hazu da… Kore wa Kage Bunshin…") Isn't this at least worth being in trivia?FlyingRaijin (talk) 13:51, April 12, 2012 (UTC) Summon Can the user summon a shadow clone far away from the real person or does he have to be near by :Naruto summoned clones from Mount Myōboku to Konoha using a scroll, if that answers your question. Jacce | Talk | 04:26, July 20, 2012 (UTC)